[Childfree] Childfree discussion

[sellers66 at comcast.net]

Since I've had more time to think about this, I'll go first :)

1. Who should be in this group?
	Who do you think should be in this group? Should we allow parents? Stepparents? Empty Nesters? What about people who have had a child but gave it up for adoption? Those who aborted? Just how childfree is childfree? Why should or shouldn’t these people be in this group?

I think it’s pretty obvious that parents do not belong in a childfree group. The original purpose of this group was to be able to have social events without dealing with people either making every subject about their kids or dragging them along whether appropriate or not. I also identify empty nesters as parents – they have kids, and probably will have grandkids, which brings us right back to why we founded a social group that didn’t include people with children. 

I am also against stepparents being in the group. I can see where this would be a big gray area for some people, so I’ll give you my reasons. First of all, in a former life I was a stepparent. Anyone who thinks that because they are not your biological children you will not have to deal with them is sorely mistaken. Even living 1000 miles from you they have a way of getting involved in every detail of your life, and along with them you get the added attraction of the ex spouse (or spouses, if you’re REALLY lucky). It’s the worst side of parenting – you get all the problems and none of the control, which makes it really hard not to make them a large percentage of your topics for conversation. In addition to that, I personally think that it’s a slap in the face to your spouse – you knew this person had kids when you married him or her, and you had to know that at least part of the time you would have to take on some parenting responsibilities. I think it says both to the spouse and t
he stepchildren that they are not too important to you, since you’d rather hang out with your childfree friends. If you’re living with someone with kids and not married, I guess I would lean towards putting you in the stepparent category. I also don’t have a lot of respect for non-custodial parents who act like they don’t have kids and/or don’t support them financially – they need to grow up and take care of their responsibilities. I really don’t feel the need to spend an evening telling that kind of person what an idiot he or she is, because they just don’t get it. Acting like you don’t have kids even though you do does not make you childfree. That ship has sailed, my friend. 

In the case of people who’ve given up a child for adoption or women who have aborted a child, I’d have to consider them childfree. First of all, it’s unlikely you’d ever know about it, since most people don’t broadcast that type of information indiscriminately across the universe. As long as the person wasn’t going around loudly bemoaning the fact that a child has been given away or aborted, I don’t see a problem with it. 

2. When should a person leave the group?
	When do you think someone should either leave the group voluntarily or be asked to leave? When they marry a person with children? When they have a child of their own? When they adopt a child? Why? How would we know if their status has changed? 

I would hope people would have enough common sense to leave the group when it becomes clear that they are no longer childfree, which in my opinion means they have either a) had a kid b) adopted a kid, or c) married someone with a kid. If someone is dating a parent, great, they can stay in the group, but I certainly do not want that parent attending childfree events. It starts the slippery slope argument that once you let one in, eventually several are in, and it defeats the purpose of the group. I would think that if you are dating a parent and it becomes serious, you would not really be all that interested in a childfree social group anyway. We’ve all had experiences where our formerly childfree friends have started having kids, and I’d be willing to bet that you don’t hang around with them as much, simply because you don’t have the same common interests anymore. It would be the same thing dating a parent – why would you want to go to an event where your significant other isn’t we
lcome?

3. Who should enforce the rules?
	Should one individual be in charge of maintaining order? If so, how do we choose that person? Should it be a group effort, and how would that work?

In a perfect world, this group would police itself. People would just have the common sense to know if it’s time to leave the group or which of their friends they can invite to group activities. Unfortunately, the reality is there is always someone who just doesn’t “get it”, and I’m not sure what the best way is to deal with that. Do we have a “board” of several people who police the group? Might be better than having just one person do it. I really don’t have a good answer to this one. 

4. What constitutes a CF event?
	What would you consider to be a “strictly” childfree event? If it’s posted to the Wiki? Sent to the Childfree mailing list at childfree at lists.robsims.com? Can someone post a non-childfree event to the email list or the Wiki as long as they state it is not childfree? 

I would think that anything posted to the Childfree Wiki should be considered strictly a childfree event. I would prefer the email list be the same way. I don’t mind the occasional “non-childfree” event posted to the mailing list as long as it is clearly stated that it is not childfree. Examples of this are Keith’s Halloween party and Rob’s New Year’s party. As long as there is a clear statement in the email that this is NOT a childfree event, then people can make an informed decision as to whether or not they want to attend. I would, however, like to see that sort of thing kept to a minimum. 
	 
5. Comments/questions 
	Add any comments/questions here. 

I’d just like to try and explain why having this childfree group is important to me. 

I am not a big fan of kids. I don’t hate them, but I don’t necessarily want to spend my free time with them, either. Generally, it’s the idiotic parenting I see more and more of every day that gets under my skin. 

I realize that not everyone is a member of this group because of the fact that it is childfree. Some of our members are just here for the social aspect, and the whole kids/parents thing is not a big deal to them, and that’s fine, as long as they respect the needs of the group. 

The childfree thing IS a big deal to me. I like having one corner of the universe where I don’t have to justify why I don’t want kids, force myself to act like everything someone’s kid does is cute or interesting or particularly amazing, and where I can invite people to my home without having to worry about someone deciding at the last minute to drag along their progeny.  I like not having to monitor everything I say because “the children”  might be listening. I like being able to have a conversation that does not revolve around diapers, nap times, or at what age a child should stop sucking its thumb. 

So, there’s my two cents - probably more like two dollars with inflation being what it is these days. :)

Ann